I’m always amazed that I didn’t know Holly Berchielli until Chris Wynne from In Effect connected us for my 914 Day event last year. For the past 25 years, Holly has been at the helm of Outsider Magazine, showcasing hardcore, punk, and metal in the Hudson Valley. Along with honoring this quarter-century milestone I wanted to dig into the many moving parts of this extensive publication, as opposed to zines that are just one person writing about stuff they like and not adhering to a traditional format or schedule. I’m in awe of Holly’s ability to organize all of this while also booking monthly shows and starting a new radio show, Bring the Noise, with the aforementioned Chris of In Effect. Read on to learn about the origins of Outsider, how issues and show lineups are assembled, and how Holly and the crew are celebrating their quarter century crisis.
Outsider Magazine is primarily distributed in the Hudson Valley and Long Island, but its habitat in the Downstate Jungle is expanding. Check out this new page that lists where you can currently pick up a copy in the 914.
Quarter Century Crisis group photos by Dave “Face” Boccio, and early Outsider photos are courtesy of Holly Berchielli.
It’s amazing that the 25th anniversary of Outsider Magazine is this year and that you have already published 38 issues! Can you give us a short summary of its history, and how you are celebrating this milestone?
I went to a very large high school, Newburgh Free Academy in Newburgh, NY, where only the Seniors were fully featured in the yearbook due to how many pages it would take to include all of the underclassmen. I would take a lot of photos with my disposable cameras throughout the year anyway, so I took it upon myself to collage and piece together a yearbook each year for my friends. I would put it all together, photo copy it, staple it and sell it for a buck or two. Around that time, I began going to shows and finding zines and thought, I can do this, I’m sort of doing this already. I got my friends involved and we put together a very silly first issue. There was never an intention for it to be very serious, but over time it just developed into a magazine with a real purpose. It kind of became the glue that connected the different parts of the Hudson Valley music and art scenes. Fast forward through all of its eras, Outsider is the strongest and best it’s ever been. Issue 38 just dropped on June 27, 2025, and we celebrated with an all-day event at Rushing Duck Brewery in Chester, NY on July 19th. We had eight punk and hardcore bands from the HV, NYC and NJ, vendors, a tattoo artist offering Outsider themed tattoos, our own Outsider Beer and Outcider, raffles to benefit the OCNY Veteran Center and our favorite DJ, Kazooie Louie, spinning records all day. It was a party. And we were able to raise a total of $1,900 for the Orange County NY Veteran Center.
What inspired you to bring back Outsider Magazine after a five year hiatus a few years ago?
I have been making Outsider for most of my life, so not having it active for long periods just feels empty. However, that’s not to say that I don’t need time to just kick back. In 2018 I realized I needed a break from the music scene. I had been publishing very regularly and booking shows as often as possible and the scene was just not in a good place at that point and neither was I. It felt like pushing against a wall. I decided to just take a year off and have some time to myself. In the late fall of 2019 I started working on what would have been Issue 34 and getting a team together with the intention of releasing the issue in the Spring of 2020, but we all know what happened instead. With the whole world shut down, bringing back a print magazine that relied on in-person networking and live shows just wasn’t going to work. By 2022, I had been away from Outsider too long and I missed it. Local shows started happening again and people would ask when the zine was coming back. I sent a bunch of emails, got the Instagram account going again, made some phone calls and started putting Issue 34 together, for real. It was just the right time. A lot of new bands had formed or gotten back together. People were ready to be a part of something again.
Has the format stayed the same over the years? I saw you can download some back issues from nyoutsiderzine.com – have you considered making even more old ones available?
The first ever issue was printed in 2000 off of my home inkjet printer and stapled in my living room. After that, I got a job at a local newspaper, called The Sentinel, and they allowed me print the zine on a press in more of an actual magazine format. That lasted until 2012. I no longer worked at the paper, but they were great to me. When I told them the date I was planning on bringing Issue 23 to them for printing, I was told they were going to switch me to newspaper format. My print runs could be bigger, the format was larger and be more cost effective. I wasn’t thrilled about it at first, but it was the right move and I have stuck with it ever since. The back issues that are available on the website are what I have in PDF format. Everything before issue 27 needs to be scanned from the original printed zines. I do intend to make more issues available for download in the future.
What were some of your favorite zines at the time you started Outsider Magazine – and now?
I have always loved magazines and comic books. In junior high, I started my monthly ritual of tracking down all my favorites. YM and Circus were my constants. I would buy Hit Parader,Flipside, Rolling Stone, Spin and Seventeen. An older friend gifted me her copies of Seventeen and I started collaging with them. Those teen girl centered magazines were just as influential on me as the music magazines were. I always had a magazine with me to read, wherever I went. When I started going to shows and finding independent record stores to shop in, there would be zines available for free or $1 and I would pick them up. There was a photocopied zine called Skank & Destroy that I got from Trash American Style in CT. That was the catalyst, I think. It looked just like those yearbooks I was making and I decided to just go ahead and continue in that vein. Today, I pick up Decibel, New Noise, Revolver … those are the only large scale music magazines that are still going that I have been reading for years. I’ve had a subscription to Bust magazine for probably 15 years. I subscribe to Razorcake. I love your zine, I Question Not Me, it’s got such a cool approach to it. There is a new zine called Through Our Eyes Zinethat I think is really great, made by a girl who is probably around the same age I was when I started Outsider. She sent me a personalized drawing when I ordered her issue, which was really cool. Frozen Screams Imprint puts out a very cool metal zine with an awesome retro aesthetic now and then in different formats. Today Forever has a lot of great photography in it. In Effect Hardcore, though technically a website today, still has us all beat as far as music content goes. This topic could be its own feature. So many zines that stick in my memory that I’ve collected over the years, Rumpshaker, Vista Fanzine, I could just keep going, but we can pause here for now, ha.
How do you organize all the features, photos, ads, etc, and wrangle all your contributors so that everything fits together cohesively (and at the right number of pages?)
Each issue starts to float around in my head as soon as the current one is off the press. A lot of the content that isn’t band/music interviews is born from conversations. Spitballing ideas or seeing something cool a friend is working on or diving deeper into a movie or pop culture topic I have always liked. Coming up with content is a combined effort, for sure. I have several regular contributors who come to me with ideas each issue and we decide what is a good fit. I myself have an ever growing list of topics or interview subjects and if I feel I am not the best person to write the piece, I pitch it to whomever I feel would be the best suited. The Zine Scene and larger band or artist features are decided on by me with contributions by Chris at In Effect Hardcore. I do some of the interviews, Chris contributes what he’s interested in and I assign the rest to my writers. Johnny No-Keys from Trouble Bound, John McGrath from General Grievance and Ethan from Grave Heist also contribute regularly. I also am very happy to have been approached by a few really great freelance writers who pitch ideas to me on subjects or bands they are very excited about. I am lucky to be able to reach out to some of the best photographers in punk and hardcore for shots. Dave “Face” Boccio is the official Outsider Photographer and Steven J. Messina, Rich Zoeller, Danielle Dombrowski all contribute pretty regularly. I sell all of the ads and do all of the layout. My best friend, Ashley, does the collage work that is featured in the zine and on the covers and some of our show flyers under her moniker Shear Destruction. I think it all just comes together in my mind as a concept and then I make categories and lists in my notebook and then just check things off as I receive them and then lay them in. A lot of stuff gets jammed into each issue and it’s really just all the years of experience that makes that work as well as it does. There are definitely times when I wonder how I am going to get everything laid into place, but it always works out. I think, at this point, I just know what each issue needs.
How do you decide who you want to highlight in upcoming issues? Do you try for a mix of genres or is that dictated by the bands that you and the contributors are most excited about at the time?
I definitely aim for a mix of genres, but that seems to happen naturally anyway. I pull from the bands I book on our shows, bands who fill out the Zine Scene form on our website and just whomever catches my interest. Chris always has great for suggestions and points me to bands from Long Island and NYC that have caught his ear. Shaun Matarrese has brought some really good writing and interviews to the zine recently. Sometimes interviews take a while to come together or get scheduled, so planning which issue it will be in can get tricky, but things always work out.
Out of all the different roles that you take on to make Outsider Magazine happen, which are your most and least favorite?
Editorial work is my favorite! I really enjoy putting an issue together and working with everyone on my team. I’ve never fully enjoyed doing interviews unless the questions come naturally, but that’s something I have been leaning into more over the years. I think I just prefer to gather my knowledge of something I am interested in organically, not through typical research. My least favorite role would be selling ads, but I try to look at it as part of the bigger picture. There is something satisfying in having the ads in each issue reflect the community, especially when they are well designed and help the pages look interesting. Zines are time capsules, documenting whichever scene they support and the ads are very much part of that. Who hasn’t read a magazine from ten, twenty years ago and not marveled at the albums, shows or clubs that were new or current at the time of printing? Same with old show flyers.
What are some of the ways that a band or zine can be part of a future issue, such as submitting something for review or buying ad space?
Both of those are good ways to get featured. There is also a form on the Outsider website where bands or artists can apply for a spot in Zine Scene. The best way to get my attention is to come to our shows or come say hi when I (or anyone in our crew) is at a show. I am far more likely to give a band a chance if I know they are participating in their scene. Jenn Small and Lindsay Gara help with all the Outsider Shows and do a lot behind the scenes for the zine and are both active in the music scene. Both of them have turned me on to bands and been excellent representatives of Outsider at events and shows I wasn’t able to attend personally. If you want to be a part of what we are doing, say hi and talk to us when you see us. For bands or anyone outside of the HV, sending me a friendly email or a letter goes a long way.
Where can someone pick up a copy of Outsider Magazine?
Copies are available at shows, on merch tables all over the place in the HV, Long Island and parts of NYC and NJ. We leave copies at tattoo shops, bars, restaurants, record stores, random places that have other free publications available, libraries and community centers. Nature’s Pantry (locations in New Windsor and Fishkill, NY) always have copies available. Readers and businesses can request copies to give out and ask to have us deliver or mail them. We do our best to accommodate. There is always the option to make a $5 donation to have an issue and sticker pack mailed to you (US addresses). I’m hoping to keep that rate going for as long as possible. To everyone who donates extra, know that you help me mail out more than I could otherwise, and that is appreciated.
Outsider at The Green Growler, Croton-on-Hudson, NY. See above for the new Serve ‘em section listing Westchester distribution!
How do you put together the lineups for your shows, and the advantages of booking at the OCNY Veteran Center?
I have a lot of friends who make really great music! I generally start with a band or bands I want to see and build around them. The best shows tend to be made up of bands who know each other and have history. It creates such a good atmosphere. I try my best to accommodate touring bands when they contact me, as well as working with other promoters like DCxPC. One thing I do try to stick to is booking mixed bills as often as possible. I enjoy shows most when the bands all have a different sound, but are still complementary to each other.
The OCNY Veteran Center is so incredibly welcoming and supportive. The space is easy to set up for a show, capacity is just the right size and they have a bar and kitchen that is separate from the show room, so it’s ideal for all ages shows.
What makes the Hudson Valley scene unique and how has it evolved over the past few decades?
There are so many different smaller scenes that make up the HV scene. There’s the HVHC crew, the punk bands, ska punk bands, we have great surf bands. There is a serious metal scene, as well as bands on the more melodic side of things. We have bands that can fit in on both heavier bills and more lighthearted shows and I feel that crossover at shows is important. The bands that come here to play from out of their area leave their mark and hopefully take some of what we do back with them. There is a lot of history here, especially through punk and hardcore and that is certainly a strength. People here tend to have deeply varied tastes, even if they don’t think it’s cool to broadcast that fact.
On top of the magazine and booking shows, you and In Effect have a radio show on WXAX … how did you get that started and what can listeners expect from the show?
Jim Arndt, the original owner of WXAX, approached me at one of my shows about having Outsider do a punk and hardcore show on his station. WXAX is predominantly a metal station and he said he wanted to bring some more variety to the lineup. I asked Chris if he would like to do the show with me and it was a natural fit. It took us a while to come up with a name, but Bring The Noise first aired on November 6th, 2024. We play a mix of new and classic punk and hardcore from Ramones to Restraining Order with a heavy focus on bands from the Hudson Valley, Long Island and NYC and bands we are featuring in the zine and on the In Effect website. The show airs on WXAX (anywhere you get internet radio) on Wednesdays from 10am-Noon EST and again from 10pm-Midnight every week.
Editor’s note: find the “Played on Bring the Noise” playlist here to identify your favorites from the show or catch up on anything you may have missed.
Outsider also always has great merch! How did you come up with the iconic logo and continue to pick interesting colorways?
Thanks! I have a lot of fun designing our merch. I have worked in graphic design and the garment industry on the retail side for a very long time. I was a professional screen printer for several years as well. The logo came about because I wanted to pay tribute to the Ramones, being that the zine is partially named after one of their songs. My friend Shawn and I first created it about twenty years ago when we used to screen print all of the Outsider merch by hand in my room. It was only used on t-shirts for years. Eventually, I had the design made digital and began using it as the official logo for the magazine. It’s changed a bit over the years and I think the version we have now is going to stick.
What’s your favorite compilation, and/or band that you discovered from a comp?
A comp that I picked up when it came out that I still listen to now and then is the Five Years On The Streets comp from Vagrant Records (1998). That’s where I discovered Face To Face.
Name one band you don’t want to be forgotten – and is there a band who was once covered in Outsider that helped them continue to be remembered?
Well, that’s a loaded question. There are a lot of bands that I have covered that don’t play anymore or are on a “hiatus” that were so good. Some have music available to stream or buy and others don’t have much of a trace left except old interviews and that’s a tough road to go down just to choose one, but a band I covered and booked that I still play on Bring The Noise and pester about a reunion show, on and off is Entropy.
Anything else you want to shout out or discuss? Thank you for doing this!
I feel like our scene here in the Hudson Valley and the punk and hardcore scene as a whole is so strong right now. For the most part, we are more connected and supportive of each other than ever from what I can tell, which is how it should be. I have met more like-minded people in the last few years than I can count. It’s been a pleasure getting to know you and I am honored to be a part of what you’re doing as well as having you contribute to Outsider. In particular, I am seeing and working with far more women in the scene than in the past and that makes me very happy.
In April 2025, I interviewed Ethan Portes-Chaikin and Dan Shaw from Grave Heist at their new venture Media Blitz Music Studios in Thornwood, NY. We talked about the space, what services they offer, what’s next for Grave Heist, and the magic of the Downstate Jungle. A condensed version of this interview was published in Outsider Magazine #38, but you can read the whole thing here. Photos (and occasional interjections) by Mike McAuley.
Becky: Can you introduce yourselves and your roles in the studio?
Dan: My name is Dan Shaw, owner/operator of Media Blitz Music Studios.
Ethan: My name is Ethan Portes-Chaikin. I am the studio engineer. I work in the recording studio, and I manage the live room.
B: Tell me about the story behind Media Blitz. How did you get the idea and what was the process like to get the doors open?
D: It started for me before I met Ethan. The last ten years I’ve been in and out of other practice studios, and most of them are shit, especially in Westchester and Putnam County, and going up the line. And it was kind of like a dream, thinking I could maybe pull it off. And then once my old band kind of fizzled out, Grave Heist was thrown in my lap. I answered a Craigslist ad because I didn’t know where to even look. I’m like, where do you look for a band nowadays? MySpace? I had no idea. So I was like screw it, Craigslist. We hit it off and in the ad as well they were looking for a guitar player.
E: I kind of had the same idea as well. We had talked about it …
E: We had a guitar player, this guy brought everybody else. And now we have Kevin as our bass player and everything kind of came together all at once.
D: I’ve had a few businesses in my lifetime and the very first one was a renovation business. I started in ‘97, worked that, and I won’t bore you with the whole entire history. Then I opened a motorcycle shop in North Carolina and that lasted 7-8 years. Came back up here and reopened that renovation shop. I’m 46 now, and I put in a lot of time and pushed my body to the limit and am like man, I got to do something else. Once we really started killing it with Grave Heist, Ethan was going to school to be an engineer and get his degree and everything, and I really started toying with the idea. I was looking at a place in Yorktown actually, remember? The rent’s not that bad, and I think I’m gonna go for it. It came up at a family dinner at my in-laws’ house. And my wife’s uncle was like, we have this building down the street. No one’s really working out of that building anymore. There used to be 25 people in there, It’s like five now. Why don’t we just move upstairs and you can rent the downstairs?
E: A lot of excitement around those ideas.
D: I was blown away. So I took them in as a buy-in too, like a silent partner. They funded the project with material and instruments in return for me doing all the labor.
E: Because like none of this was the way it was.
D: Yeah, like that wall wasn’t there. There was an open room there. All these rooms that we have now, there were three different offices in them, we took doors out, the whole bit. We spent about eight months after work putting this together. And saving all the money as far as hiring anybody to do it. So it took a little bit longer, but now with my silent partner being family, we’re dead even. And we started taking clients in January 2025 and it really started to start popping off, so it’s obviously in its baby stages.
E: Dan would send me the building process, like unfinished rooms, and specifically it was cool to see my room come together. I remember when he cut out the window and it was just a blank space in the wall and it became beautiful. We’re both proud that the studio is really a beautiful place to be in. He hung the records on the wall. All cool records. Everybody comes here and recognizes a record. There’s something for everybody.
D: I wanted this place to be like that hub of people to feel comfortable coming here. Because how many times have you been in these places and everyone’s got attitude, especially in recording studios.
E: We love what we’ve done in Grave Heist, but there’s always one thing we feel could have been done better, and we want to provide that for bands where it’s like no stone is left unturned. You know, at the end of the day, I might not like totally what comes out, but it’s not up to me to like it, it’s up to the band, and the band is what matters.
D: This is my mix, this is how I hear it. However you hear it is how I want you to have it. And that’s what he’s done so far with the guys and gals that have come through here, and it’s been awesome.
B: What’s something you want people to know about the studio or that sets you apart? And how has being able to control everything affected Grave Heist’s process?
D: Our mission that’s slowly building right now is producing more music on a different level. Different genres, more commercial, hip-hop, whatever it may be. And then also with sampling.
E: We’re not just gonna offer audio services or rehearsals. We’re offering video services, podcast recording, photo editing … really a one-stop shop. And a lot of that in turn is going to help us with Grave Heist, because at the end of the day, we’re coming here to record our next EP or whatever it becomes. So like you were just talking about, it gives us a lot of control. And it’s something I think subconsciously the band has wanted for a while, because a lot of things tend to impede our control over what we do, and I think this is one of the biggest steps we’ve taken towards ending that and making it about what Grave Heist wants. And the music will show that for sure.
E: A beautiful thing about this studio is that you see two hardcore dudes built the studio. You think it’s just going to be hardcore. We’re only going to deal with metal bands. No, we want to do pop. We want to do rap…
D: My first love is jazz music.
E: Exactly! He loves jazz … I’ve done every genre of music in the past. Whatever you bring me, we’re gonna make it work. And we’re not just gonna offer audio services or rehearsals. We’re offering video services, podcast recording, photo editing … a one-stop shop. And a lot of that in turn is going to help us with Grave Heist, because at the end of the day, we’re coming here to record our next EP. It gives us a lot of control and it’s something I think subconsciously the band has wanted for a while, because a lot of things tend to impede our control over what we do. This is one of the biggest steps we’ve taken towards ending that and making it about what Grave Heist wants. And the music will show that for sure.
D: We haven’t been open very long, but I’ve already met some really awesome people coming through here. There’s this guy Bruce, he has a wedding band, and they’re like an eight or nine piece. And he’s got another band, it’s like a full-on country band. But when Bruce first stepped in here, I met him down here. I like to start off, especially with the guys who come down and rehearse. They’ll come and meet me here, I’ll give them a tour, I’ll walk them through and everything. This way, it’s just more intimate. Getting to know the people instead of just rolling in there, and you’re staring at the guys in the room like, yeah, you’re three. Boom. Bye. Especially the first initial, I have them fill out a very light questionnaire online when they book the studio, and it’s just like, name of the band, how many members, how many mics you need, and if you have any social accounts, because I will spread the word on our on our socials and stuff. But to circle back, with Bruce and his band, he came in the first time and he’s a stern guy and knows what he wants and I could read that off him immediately. And we kind of hit it off in our own little way. After he rehearsed the first time, I think two weeks went by and he booked a four hour. He called me up and was like, do you know anybody who does video editing because we have a big show over at Lucy’s in Pleasantville and I don’t know if you guys do that, I didn’t notice on your website. He asked me to come and capture an hour of their first performance, it was like a showcase for their wedding band, and he didn’t even want me to edit it. I guess he was a retired video editor at the time, from CBS. And I put together this whole thing for him, and he was so pumped.
E: And then, what happened next, we got another offer …
D: Yeah, that night, I was talking to the sound guy and he was like my father has a band and he wants to do the same thing, so in two weeks we were doing that. So there’s a lot of avenues down here, we want to cover them all and we want to be that one-stop shop. Even down the road. I have some more space. I still have my mill shop for my renovation. It’s in Somers, I built it with my father in ‘94. I’d like to turn that into a silk screening place. Silk screening or anything that’s in the avenue to help music out, you know what I mean? If I could just get people in there just to have a building and produce, I don’t care, you know what I mean? Because it’s hard enough to have space. Especially how much it freaking costs on top of it all, you know?
E: We have stuff under wraps that we’re working on as well. Dan and I are naturally creatives. And he doesn’t just play drums. He scratches. And every one of us in the band is like that, and I think that’s what makes this studio so great is because it’s a collaborative effort. All of it comes together. Dan’s a carpenter, he has business know-how. I’ve been engineering since I was and making music since I was ten. And I’ve made a lot of connections in the general area. Haven’t really branched out a lot further than that, but I have my little connections that are quite well known, and so I want to provide whatever I can to this studio, and that also means bringing in other people that are like-minded. Like, we just met this guy Plinio, who wants to do great stuff in terms of producing music and making music that we could essentially either license or create a new band with.
D: Yeah, one other step I’d like to take, as far as trying to do something here either once a month, once every other month, do like a musicians’ social. Just have an open house. Everyone comes in, get some food, sodas, beers, whatever, and just have musicians kind of just mingle, because everyone’s always looking for somebody. And then maybe put together an open mic night. Dedicate one of these rooms and people come in and show off their stuff, and make it available to the community. Where this place is, it is a good central location. It’s 21 miles to Yankee Stadium, the train’s right here. You can’t take the train obviously from here to Yankee Stadium, but Tarrytown’s right across the way. It’s in a central part which is convenient for a lot of people. I even have it on the website too. It’s like, listen, you gotta take the train here. I’ll come and get your ass, and I’ll take you back there to go home. Whatever, I got you man, I want you to feel like you got a home here. I want everyone to feel like it’s a community.
B: I noticed there’s two different Instagrams: Media Blitz Music Studios and Media Blitz Creative. What are the services that are under each?
E: They’re kind of just under the same name …
D: I’m gonna cut you off man, he just wanted to throw his dick on it … I could have just gave him the Media Blitz thing but he wanted to have his own …
E: Realistically it’s for my portfolio. That’s where I list everything I’ve done.
D: He’s gonna get a bill soon, it’s all good.
B: So the Creative is you and the Studios is the studio?
D: I’m business, he’s casual.
E: Yeah, exactly. I like it that way.
B: So you do album art, flyers, video editing, the podcasting … how have all these unique services helped the studio and Grave Heist stand out?
E: We say this about both of us, really about everybody in Grave Heist, but me personally I’ve always been an artist above all, so it doesn’t just translate to music. It doesn’t just translate to visual stuff. It translates to every kind of way you can be artistic. I used to cook and that was my way of being artistic aside from music. Now, I think visual art has kind of absorbed the space. But here specifically, Dan and I work together so well, he’s given me a place to thrive, where no matter what I can come here and create and do what I need to do for the people I need to do it for. And it’s a safe space, it’s a comfortable space. Then on top of it while I’m doing this, Dan’s in the lab working on new ways to make this business more successful. And we’re already getting a solid pickup.
D: This local author right here in town just published her memoir about postpartum and having her children …
E: “A Journey Through Spirit” [by Francesca Zerbo].
D: Her editor talked her into doing her audiobook, and she went and visited quite a few studios. And she came and she chose us. She said it was local supporting local, but at the same time she liked the vibe here.
E: She loved it.
D: I was here, Monday was the first session that Ethan did, and I met him in the morning here, and they fell in love with the guy. He’s a likeable dude. He sells himself short all the fucking time, but he’s a likeable guy and they caught that immediately. I’ll come set it up, I’ll tee it up for you, you just gotta take it from there, baby.
E: It’s pretty much how it goes every time.
D: It’s been working, and it’s all honesty. There’s no bullshit here. The first thing I said when I joined Grave Heist was like, listen, man. I’m an easy guy to get along with. I wear my heart on my sleeve. I ain’t gonna lie to you, I don’t give a fuck. I’m married 20 years. I got one kid in college, another one going in another year and a half. So I got no bullshit, what you’re gonna get from me is me. That’s it. And I want everybody that walks through the door the same exact way. It’s just what it is.
E: Yeah and you specifically have a way of bringing people into your way of thinking, like …
D: I’m brainwashing?
E: Nah, it’s really just like you always tell me “just be you.” Once he joined Grave Heist, it really bounced off. We were like, okay, we got the confidence now dude!
D: Thanks buddy.
E: It’s true. And then we tied up some loose ends.
D: Yeah and we worked it out.
E: And it really made it shine. I mean, let’s talk ourselves up. That “Desperate Times” EP is one of our favorite things we’ve ever written.
D: We chiseled off what we chiseled to make that happen. We had some lineup changes, not even just one lineup change, but that was the next step.
E: Making it like a whole unit was perfect because it allowed us to explore new avenues. And then even with this new EP coming out, we’re gonna explore more than we ever have.
D: That’s the name of the game. And it’s hard enough just getting a few people together. But five guys at this age, just trying to get music together that people will enjoy is next to impossible. We do have a good thing going, the chemistry’s there, and we’ve been tested. We’re not this huge-ass band, but we’re building, and that’s what it takes. If you can put together, it’s only been two years … but if you can stay a band four years and keep going after that four years, you’re over a massive hump, and that’s the plan right now. If we can stay together and keep topping each release, we’re gonna do great.
E: Recently what really showed it for me that we’re on a good track, was we had just finished God’s Favorite, recording them and their new EP, and we went to play this show with Humantrainwreck at the Saw Mill Tavern. And the show just went so well. With turnouts, you kind of have to expect what comes, and this was a great turnout, but it was different, I’ll say. We were accepted so immediately, like even before we started playing. And we knew people there. What really made it kick in for me was when Brass Knuckle Brigade, the vocalist said I love you guys. But my son fucking loves you. He said by like the second song or whatever he was, like, “Dad. I love this band.” And he’d already followed us on Instagram.
D: That’s an ongoing thing we talk about. I don’t care how many people are there if I can reach one person while playing our music. Not that I even think about this as a job, but the mission of playing and why we play is to hit one person. And I haven’t been disappointed yet. And that Tavern show was awesome because it was nice to see so many people from my generation getting together again – and for a show locally!
E: You knew everybody!
D: And I was, like, whoa! And then talking to people, they knew all of Rise … I talked to a couple guys like, oh, yeah, you know, Christian Blaney? And I was like dude I played in a band with him! I’m like, what! It was so cool to just bump into those heads. And then you had a younger crowd there as well.
E: Yeah, there was a young band that played. Deadline?
B: Shoutout to Deadline.
E: They were fucking incredible.
D: Yeah, dude, yeah, that’s where it all starts.
E: That’s another thing about us here, especially, is we want to bring a lot more youth.
Mike: I’m gonna interject, what I’ve been saying about the young bands is young bands are amphibians …
E: Absolutely!
M: If you see frogs and salamanders and shit in a river, you know it’s a healthy fucking waterway because animals cannot thrive in polluted ecosystems. Same thing with a hardcore, punk scene, if you see young bands popping up in an area …
E: It’s doing good.
M: Something’s going in the right direction. Yeah it’s been a long time since I saw young bands in this area.
E: And it’s happening all over. It’s happening in our area too.
D: It’s a little harder to find the venues. They’re there, but it’s hit or miss. You have some people who are so on fire to get these shows together and like, they’ll do like two, and then another set of people will come in a couple months later. They do the same thing, the momentum’s there, and it kind of just fizzles out. I wish that I had more time to start doing that, to branch out into that. This place obviously takes precedence over everything as far as right now. I’m trying to get this on track, but that’s something that I’d like to visit. My son’s coming home from college in a couple months, and I talked to him about it. I’m like you’re old enough, he’s 20 on Monday. I’m like, dude, you’re gonna come home. You could start putting together shows, and you’re not gonna make a ton of money, but it’s something you could throw in a gas tank and then meet community, meet connections and then you become part of it.
Saturday, March 22, 2025. NYHC Comics Presents Hardcore in the 914. Deadline was added after I made the flyer.
E: I know you said this place is top priority, but I feel like Grave Heist is also on that plane.
D: Oh, I’m talking about as far as business-wise.
E: But honestly I feel like you treat both with such drive and so do I.
D: Yeah, they’re both important to me. I put everything into it, you know for both because I honestly didn’t think that I’d be doing this again, and I told Ethan when we started it like, and this thing’s gonna go. I was like, dude, this is it. I’m gonna give 100% into this, like I always do in every band, but every band I’ve always been in has gotten to that spot, and it’s never climbed over that four year hump because everyone gets kind of stretched out and bored. This hasn’t been like that. There really hasn’t been anything too stale to where we haven’t overcome, because everyone’s still creating, everyone’s still writing. There’s always something going on. And if someone’s feeling a little something, someone’s pulling it in the other direction to get us going, and it hasn’t failed yet. We’ve got a good little crew man, we really do.
E: Dan and I take a lead role, but I think we’re all huge contributors. I remember the late nights Dan and I would spend on the phone, just planning shit out and it really helped us get to where we are now. And now I feel like we don’t have to have those calls because we’re pretty self-sufficient.
D: Yeah we try to catch up once a month and kind of crunch everything together like what’s on the docket? What are the goals? And simplify because less is more and you can’t be in every freaking direction.
E: Even just buying merch takes a lot of planning.
D: Yeah, getting everyone to agree on it, because everyone needs their input. I don’t want to put out stuff that nobody wants to wear, or nobody wants to put their name on.
E: But this place makes it a lot easier.
B: You guys have a lot of momentum right now. When exactly did Grave Heist start – you said two years ago?
E: We had our first show March 17, 2023.
D: And that’s when I call when a band’s official.
E: But I will say just for the record, we started practicing together I think, in December or November 2022.
D: The first practice I had was a couple days after Halloween. I spoke to Zach on Halloween because I was throwing out candy to kids at the same time.
E: The first time you met was at practice? Or you met him at a show?
D: No, I met him at practice. I talked to him on the phone. And when I told him I have a son that’s a senior, he was like oh God, he thought I was some old geezer. I was like nah man it ain’t like that, I just had ‘em young. So yeah, beginning of ‘23 …
B: And then we discovered you guys at the Mount Vernon show which was October 2023. That was how we discovered Grave Heist. We were like there’s a hardcore show in Mount Vernon?
D: And it was so funny when you [Mike] were like you were the drummer of Rise? I’m like get the fuck out of here. I love how this works, man, it all kind of circles again.
M: It always does.
D: I fucking love it, man.
E: We actually play sometimes with a band that Dan has history with – Fire Is Murder.
D: Chris Nolen is the singer. I played in a band with him, Josh has played in a few different bands with him. We all grew up together. He was in a band God Awful, Blueprint, Rainmen …that was Boardwalk days. God Awful, Absorb, Subzero, Media Blitz … we were like the locals at that time. Sealed With A Fist, Jasta 14, Drowning Room, Bed of Stone …
B: Fire Is Murder played one of the Saw Mill shows – the Leeway one? Before I get back to Saw Mill stuff, what are everyone’s hidden talents?
E: I draw, and I draw weird stuff.
D: Yeah, you’re a weirdo.
E: Yeah, exactly.
D: No, he downplays himself with everything. Ethan’s a talented guy but he downplays all of this shit. He’s his worst critic, but most people are when it comes to their art, so I get that.
E: Dan scratches and loves bikes. And I’m gonna say is a killer skateboarder, ‘cause for all I know he can still skateboard.
D: I still can skate. It’s funny, I quit street skating when I moved to North Carolina because I found transition. I never skated any kind of a pool or anything and that’s all that was down in North Carolina, so it was like a whole new thing. So I taught my son how to skateboard by the time he was three and Lou could shred. But now he had to give it up because he’s jacked, and he’s just too big. He just can’t do it. It doesn’t work for him. But I skated back in the day. I was big into skateboarding. I’m a certified state and city welder. I picked up welding because I was making frames. My family had a heavy equipment company forever, for like 66 years. I learned how to weld when I was a kid, then a cabinet maker. My favorite thing is being a dad though.
E: What is Josh’s hidden talent? I know Kevin’s hidden talent is not being a stoner but being the most stoner person you’ve ever met.
D: But he’s a closet fucking sound guy. He is like a closet engineer.
E: He doesn’t engineer, but he knows how to.
D: It’s pretty funny. Josh’s got a bunch of shit. He’s a killer artist. I don’t care what he says, I already know the face he’s gonna make if this goes into print: the dude can sing.
E: I wanna hear it.
D: I’ve known Josh a very long time. I played in one of the best bands, I mean better than Grave Heist (laughter) … we played in Shoot the Messenger.
E: People have said that before.
D: We were like a post-hardcore band. And the time was crazy, it just didn’t work out. Then we brought it back and that’s when Chris Nolen from Fire is Murder joined the band, so it was kind of Shoot the Messenger 2.0. But Josh, he’s just an awesome straight up dude.
E: Kenny [Zach] I’d say, is the same, very stand-up guy. He doesn’t have a lot of hobbies other than hanging out with his dog, he’s about to have a baby …
D: He was a hockey player back in the day.
E: Yeah he was a great hockey player. Great football player. Well, I don’t know what he would say, but HenHud sucks, I don’t know.
D: I was a closet wrestler. I got thrown out of sports in high school, but I did wrestling.
E: The talent of some people that follow us, like Frankie Forearms got that wrestling talent. He’s got a hidden talent.
D: Yeah, my son ended up wrestling until college, now he plays rugby. But they combined schools so it was Westlake-Valhalla, the local schools around here. A friend of his who was on the wrestling team is actually in the wrestling entertainment business. I just saw him, he had a match in Queens. And he came to the Ardsley show! It was cool.
B: You should tell Gary from Brass Knuckle Brigade. He knows about wrestling. I do not know about wrestling.
D: It’s funny, I’m like ‘80s, ‘90s. He’s like two thousands. He knows more about that than I do.
E: And I know nothing about what you know about, like the old school stuff. I’m so bad. I’ve gone back to watch some of it, but it’s hard for me because of the quality, I don’t know what it is.
D: You’re spoiled, man!
E: I know, I am! I’m really spoiled.
D: There’s 13 years separating us, you know?
E: Yeah, I’m a technology kid.
D: So it’s just different. He and Zach fall right between my son and I. He’s exactly the same amount older than my son that I’m older than him, it’s pretty funny.
B: While we’re talking about sports, who is a baseball fan in the band, and which teams? And how do we feel about the Knicks’ playoff chances?
E: OK, I’m gonna be much quicker than him, so I’ll just say this. I’m a Mets fan. I wear a Yankees pendant …
B: I was wondering about that!
E: …and he is a Yankees fan. I wear a Yankees pendant literally because there is nothing Mets-related.
D: New York Yankees, built to last (gestures to tattoo) … I even have it on there, Built to Last.
E: I don’t call this a Yankees pendant, it’s a New York pendant.
D: [points to lip tattoo] I actually had a southern guy do this [lip tattoo] while I was down in North Carolina. The Y is gone but it was just “Yankee”. But yeah I’m a huge basketball fan. I love basketball. I love college basketball. I love baseball. As far as the Knicks, I don’t know man, the last couple seasons have been magical. There’s no telling.
E: It’s like the Rangers.
D: That’s the thing. It’s like a toss-up. You don’t know where it’s gonna go. It all depends. I’m keeping it very vague because I don’t want to jinx anything.
B: I do always seem to do interviews in April, like two years ago when Killing Time was playing Saw Mill. I was like what’s up with the Knicks playoff chances. Maybe I should stop doing interviews in the spring and asking this question.
D: As far as baseball, I’m definitely a diehard Yankees fan. Been to probably 200 games. We had season tickets, the same seats for three years.
M: At the old stadium?
D: Yeah, old stadium. And when those seats went on sale, I sold a dirt bike and bought one. I should bring that here. And it’s a number three, there’s a big number three on the thing. It’s so dope. And I think I played video games in that chair for like four years.
B: That’s my next list, how many Yankees games I’ve been to. Do you have a list of what shows you’ve played? You knew right away what your first show was.
E: The problem with the iPhone is that I’ll take pictures and all the other pictures will sync back. But I’ll occasionally get all our flyers in one shot.
D: I have them in a folder.
E: OK so I should be using folders. He’s more technological than I am! But yeah I try and compile all our flyers, but I think we’ve played over 30 shows now, easily. I think the last time I counted we were at 27.
D: Yeah and this is old. I gotta update them. There’s quite a few in there.
B: It’s good you guys are doing it as you go, as opposed to having to look back and count them up later.
E: Thankfully we have a good handle on what we post and how much we post on Instagram. So it’s easy to find all the shows.
D: You know, I didn’t get a lot of credit as well. I thought that was a cool ass flyer.
B: That is a cool flyer and you can read the bands.
D: It was The Goonies flyer, I even got the font and everything. Yeah, that was a great one. Oh I do have another secret talent: Call of Duty, baby.
E: Oh yeah, he’s good at Call of Duty.
D: I love Call of Duty, man. I play it every single day. Every single night I play Call of Duty.
E: It’s his reliever. His relaxation time. I used to play it a little.
D: If you put it in there, my gamer tag is killiss, with two S’s. Willis, aka killis.
B: Let’s talk a little bit about the Hudson Valley. You use the term Downstate as well as Hudson Valley and had 914 on the back of the Knicks shirts, which I appreciate. Where is everyone from, and was finding a location in Thornwood a way to connect Westchester and the Hudson Valley and all these overlapping scenes?
E: Kenny [Zach] and Dan and I started the band, but Kenny and I were probably the true forerunners because we had the idea and we brought everyone in. Well, Dan really brought Josh in. But we’re all from different places. Kenny and I are from the Peekskill area, like Cortlandt Manor, Buchanan, whatever. So, I think that’s where for me the Downstate Jungle came from because the city’s got the concrete jungle and we’re kind of that gap, that middle part between the city and higher up Hudson Valley. So I was like we need a name to separate us a little bit from the Hudson Valley while still keeping our Hudson Valley name as well. Kenny always used to call us, he was like we’re not upstate hardcore, we’re downstate hardcore. When we used to make bands back in the day.
D: Oh that’s cool, I didn’t even know that.
E: So basically, he inspired that. And it sounds so good coming off the tongue. It’s fun to say, and I think it represents us the most because it bridges the gap. Kevin’s from Carmel …
D: Josh is from Mahopac, I’m from Brewster …
E: Exactly. Kenny used to live in Pelham, so it even makes more sense.
D: I was born in Mount Kisco.
B: Yeah I knew you had somebody in Pelham.
E: I used to live in Queens, so that’s probably where you see the city kid come out a little bit and the Dominican side of me, where all that is …
D: You were three! Write that down.
E: Aah I fuckin’ hate this guy.
D: I’m from Milledgeville, Georgia.
E: There you go. That’s another thing about our situation is that everybody’s got a lot of history.
D: Yeah, totally. I spent every summer until I was 17 …
E: This guy, he has a story for every little fucking thing.
D: And I don’t want to be that guy. But I spent every summer until I was 17 in Milledgeville, Georgia, where my mother’s mother is from. She’s one of ten, so I’m talking red clay roads, you know, the rusted roofs? Everything. My grandmother lived on 280 acres. She had the country style, you know what I mean, tons of stuff I can go into. That’s a whole nother thing.
E: We’ll talk about the planes crashing recently, and he’ll be like, yo I remember this one time I drove this plane back to fucking Idaho and fuckin’ landed in the Atlantic…
D: Yo bro, my mom’s oldest sister…
E: Yo, here we go, here we go!
D: My mom’s older sister, my aunt Carolyn, was in a plane wreck, and she’s the only one who survived. With her fiance, it was a small little shuttle bus basically, and they landed in the ocean, in the Atlantic. She tried to save him, but she’s the only one who lived!
B: While we’re still talking about the local stuff, what are things like lately in the Downstate in terms of shows and new bands? Am I right that this is the most exciting things have felt for years in the 914?
E: Tell them about how we are trying to get some shows here.
D: Pleasantville’s got two venues. One of them, Lucy’s, just went under new management. But there’s another studio in town that I didn’t really know about. It’s in Hawthorne, which is basically Thornwood. Anyway, the guy who owns that studio, it’s a small one room rehearsal studio slash recording studio I think? I don’t know, it’s run out of a home. He took over booking over there at Lucy’s. He doesn’t know us personally, so I have yet to go over and speak to the guy. But then there’s another place called Paulies. It’s a college bar for Pace and it’s directly across the street from the train station. It’s got a little stage, but it’s just as big as the Saw Mill. And they’re not open on Sundays. Man, it is a key place for Sunday matinees.
D: Kenny keeps saying his cousin or something is like part owner of that place or some shit. I’m like, well, do something about it! There is a lot of potential in Lower Westchester. White Plains, forget about it.
M: White Plains is a weird cultural void and always has been.
D: It is! It’s very strange. If someone had a spot there they would crush because the train station, and it’s not far from you guys.
E: It’s similar to Peekskill because Peekskill doesn’t have any venues. The only one we’ve made use of is Second Nature, which is a skate park. That went amazing both times.
M: RIP Popeyes.
E: There used to be Arts on the Lake in Carmel or Mahopac. There also used to be a vets center in Brewster, a Brewster Legion Hall that Kevin used to book out of.
D: I wasn’t around for that.
E: Those were all death metal and deathcore shows, but he brought some acts that became big over there.
D: We had the Boardwalk and then the Briar Patch which was a bowling alley in Carmel. That brought in a lot of people. A lot of different bands. But I heard something about Port Chester?
M: Yeah Shatterhand’s doing a record release there in April.
B: We’re excited to have you on the “A Good Problem to Have” comp on Memory Loss Records! What’s your favorite hardcore comp and your favorite comp track?
E: I did a comp that I was really proud of that had a lot of Hudson Valley bands on it.
D: Mine was “Victory Style II” with the band Guilt. That song I still jam to this day.
E: This is not a comp but I really like the No Echo playlists. He always puts the top ends on there and the best bands. And I really love how a lot of the times you’ll have shows, and then they’ll put together a playlist of the bands from the shows. Those are kind of modern versions of compilations almost, which there’s room for both because a good compilation is always great. I used to listen to a lot more rap stuff so every time I think of compilations, it’s always like mixtapes.
B: Outside of hardcore, what other styles of music does everyone in the band listen to, and how has that influenced your songwriting process?
D: For me, I was lucky enough to grow up in the best era of hip-hop …
E: And I listened to a lot of that era after the fact.
D: You’re welcome.
E: Yeah, literally. His people. His fucking generation.
D: And like I said earlier, I’m a huge, huge, huge jazz guy. And as for hardcore stuff, in that genre there’s just so much. My all-time favorite bands, there’s three right off the bat: Into Another, and Candiria, because Kenneth Schalk is my favorite drummer hands down. Best drummer, he makes a three-piece set sound like it’s got 50. I follow him on YouTube. I watch all his shit every day it comes out, he’s amazing. And Leeway, because Pokey, I feel like I relate to his solid drumming more than any in the hardcore realm.
E: I think Kenny’s influenced by a lot of powerviolence or old school hardcore. And Josh likes a lot of different stuff.
D: And Ray from District 9 and Fahrenheit 451 one of my favorite live drummers to see.
E: I’d say hip-hop itself is probably the biggest inspiration if you couldn’t tell already. The Grave Heist shit is pretty hip-hop in terms of dictation in the way the lyrics are said. I like every type of genre, but hip-hop and rap specifically were my jams. That’s what I grew up on. I grew up on Nas, I had Nas and Tupac tattooed on my arm. I would consider myself a surveyor of all the beefs like Nas/Jay-Z, Tupac/Biggie, 50 Cent and Murder Inc. All those things definitely inspired me as a musician. So when it came to hardcore, I would see all these hardcore bands be influenced by rap, and it made me think that’s kind of what I want to do. Before this band I had not really gotten the chance to explore a lot of my own creativity in a band. So when I got into this band, I went all out and that’s kind of why the first EP has that echo sound and that reverb sound because I was really into Power Trip at the time. A lot of the parts of the music that I write are influenced by things that are relevant to me at the time. So it goes hand in hand, you’ve got the hardcore sound, from modern days of me listening to new hardcore, and then you’ve got the hip-hop side of me that will just spit a DJ line on a song, like DJ call outs. And I think that’s really what brings the band together as far as our sound. I think the rest of the band would say that we have a certain sound and it’s rounded out by the production of the vocals and how it goes down.
B: Maybe that’s why I like Grave Heist … you guys have some metal influences and I don’t really like metal, but I like rap a lot more.
E: It’s funny you say that, because I feel like we are a good blend of these different aspects of metal and then hip-hop. One thing that kind of grabs people for us is that you have the thrash element and nobody in thrash is doing hip-hop lyrics. So you’ve got that thrash element and you’re still having the hip-hop sound a little bit in the vocals, and then you get the hardcore, where it makes sense. And so it all comes together into something that all of us can be proud of and it relates to all of us. Dan’s groovy, Josh is the thrash guy, Kenny’s the hardcore guy, Kevin’s Kevin, and I’m the hip-hop guy.
D: Honestly, if you don’t like us, that’s fine. I don’t give a fuck. I’ll give you an example. My wife, she’s a high school English teacher. She’s in the middle of getting her doctorate. She’s not into metal, not into hardcore. A very introverted woman, awesome lady. She listens to us because we tell a story with some of our songs. We kind of hit a chord there with people who aren’t usually listening to that style of music.
E: The lyrics have some personal stories.
(Dan stepped out to take a phone call and we picked back up talking about Ethan’s vocals.)
B: I wouldn’t like Grave Heist if I didn’t like the vocals.
D: Yeah, he’s got another range that nobody even knows about.
E: I have so many ranges, but this is one of them.
D: I was blown away. I’m like, dude, you gotta pull that out in one of our new songs.
E: I tried doing it at home and it was similar, so I’d probably work back to it. There’s a tone I have that’s very Keith Buckley, Every Time I Die, that kind of sound.
D: I showed it to my son. I was like, listen to this. I’m like, what does it sound like? He’s like, it sounds like ETID but it’s not. I’m like, that’s Ethan. He’s like, are you serious? I was blown away.
B: What are some of the coolest places you’ve played so far? And a dream show destination inside or outside the US, and what shows do you have coming up?
E: Definitely the Palladium for me, and I’m sure it is for Kenny as well.
D: I want to play that fest in Florida, FYA.
E: I really loved the skate park show.
D: One of my favorites where the show wasn’t all that great but the venue was really cool, was in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania. That was a cool spot.
E: And then shows coming up, we have a bunch in Queens. We’re really looking forward to some shows in the city and beyond. He wants to go to Rhode Island real bad …
D: Yeah, ‘cause my son’s there. He goes to school right there, and we had a [now canceled] show booked there for Saturday. And he already had the rugby team going. He was all ready to go.
E: And then as for anything else, we’re definitely going to be doing a lot on this new EP. I think “Desperate Times” surprised people …
D: This is definitely gonna surprise people. We’re out to top that. This one is gonna blow everything away.
E: Put it this way, I know you guys have heard a little snippet. We already wrote a single for the comps coming out. We’re gonna have one on yours and hopefully also on Blood Domain. They’re kind of our record label, but we’re just affiliated with them. We’re seeing how it goes with releasing something under somebody, but we’re definitely open for opportunities and he knows that. He’s gonna help us get a little more outside of our area, and then also we’re gonna help him get a little more recognition of his label. He also runs Iron Fortress, which is his death metal label.
D: That’s what he’s trying to do is step out of that and create something else.
E: Which is great. And that’s one thing we love to do is support other people in their ventures. The motivation behind this EP is a lot different. “Desperate Times” was a lot of us figuring out who we really were and putting that onto a record. This one we already know who we are, and we’re trying to explore that. We’re trying to figure out what else we could be.
D: We weren’t complete either because of the bass situation.
E: You will never notice on the record, but the bass situation could have been dogshit.
D: Josh’s brother recorded the bass tracks for us.
E: And he killed it! We were about to go in there the day before with no bassist. And then he comes in, and I think me and Dan separately begged him to do this. He came and learned the songs on the spot. He didn’t hear anything before that. Josh ran him through the songs, about two times maybe per song. And he just killed it.
D: Yeah, all off the dome.
E: So we’re trying to record, we’re trying to get out to different places, and we’re trying to build our game better. Build our brand better.
D: It’s funny, we almost changed the name.
E: That’s another thing, we almost changed the name real recently. Some of us are fans of Grave Heist the name. Some of us are a little iffy on it. But we’ve all grown on it. It’s us. Now people know us by that. If we were to change our name, it might send a signal that we aren’t confident in who we are, which we very much are.
D: And it’s done as Grave Heist. It’s gotten us where we’ve tried to go so far.
